Author Topic: The Portable Dog Killer / Quiet Canine Competition  (Read 52994 times)

birrbert

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Re: The Portable Dog Killer / Quiet Canine Competition
« Reply #30 on: January 21, 2013, 12:38:57 PM »
I'd like to sign up too! ;D

Photo story: multimeter out in the window, shot in the evening with 15 sec exposure time.

Thanks!
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MJLorton

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Re: The Portable Dog Killer / Quiet Canine Competition
« Reply #31 on: January 23, 2013, 02:23:24 AM »
Brilliant! Thanks for the picture and for signing up!
Play, discover, learn and enjoy! (and don't be scared to make mistakes along the way!)

Skorch

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Re: The Portable Dog Killer / Quiet Canine Competition
« Reply #32 on: January 23, 2013, 04:54:01 AM »
So the back story to this is I came across this competition and with it, the notion of electronic ultrasonic sound effecting animals in a way unknownst to us. After my first attempt at it, I found myself left with a cool electronic paperweight and so was somewhat discourged.
However I heard recently that one of my relatives was having trouble with mice, the particular trouble was that they weren't actually in the house itself where you might stand a chance of catching them but instead between the floorboards and ceiling and potentially wall's.
So at a recent family gathering the all the men decided to discuss ideas as to how to exterminate these cunning creatures who had begun to take a liking to chewing out the wiring in my poor uncles house, taking lights, showers and T.V.'s out simply by stopping the flow of power to them from within the walls, this being made a worse problem as no electrician wanted the job of getting between those same walls to fix them. 



The Conclusion of all the great men in my family combined as the women were discussing what to do if the mice got at the lovely curtains or gorgeous oak kitchen units, was that it was time to call in the professionals.
After being qouted some incredible prices my auntie and uncle were begining to think it would be cheaper the to let the mice have the godforsaken house(Nature 1 vs. Man 0).
Any way an exterminator was paid and the poor creatures were left to their faith.



However upon a recent resurgence of the mice in several rooms of the house all hope was again lost, I quietly asked if I could test my device in one of their rooms and so far having now tried three different rooms over the course of a month, they feel its had such success that they want them fitted one or two to a room to every room in the house and now even the neighbours are trying to get in on the act.

My device is simple an arduino connected to a ping, running on one of the simplest of sketches that I could find on the internet, with very slight modifications just to increase range and delay times. As far as I know it generates a frequency of around 40kHz, which as far as I know is a frequency, such as one might expect from a young mouse when in distress, which was actually a total and utter fluke; of all the frequncies that it could have emitted it was that one.

But just before I go any further I would just like some opinions does this all sound reasonable to you out there in the know because I just cant believe what I'm hearing about these so called miracle devices and in all honesty I don't want to waste any of my relatives hard owned money as so far Arduino's have only been borrowed or have been my own and well my uncle would also have to consider the cost of labour, i.e. you wouldnt believe how many cups of tea/coffee and family meals I would expect to be invited over for after a favour such as this :D.
Anyway Thanks Guys!

P.s. Martin hard luck about your time in Dublin, tis as the folk songs sing a "dirty aul town" and this country has so much more too it, not that I'm saying Cork is infinately more beautiful and friendly than that so called "metropolitan city" but definately out west was worth a look, hope you managed to make it out that way as well because that city can often provide the wrong impression altogether of my country to the wandering man.
Im sure the irish tourism board would love this.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2013, 05:28:46 AM by Skorch »

Skorch

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Re: The Portable Dog Killer / Quiet Canine Competition
« Reply #33 on: January 23, 2013, 11:13:40 AM »
Actually one more thing as well, one of the big disadvantages of this system as well is that its only works for a short period of time, before near as I can tell the serial monitor reaches its full capacity or it may well be the microcontroller or god knows what else?
Id like to find a program that doesnt require restarting every few hours via the usb trigger attached to my uncles laptop.
The program I currently using can be found at;
http://www.xappsoftware.com/wordpress/2012/03/15/how-to-interface-the-hc-sr04-ultrasonic-ranging-module-to-arduino/

RiccardoGiuliani

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Re: The Portable Dog Killer / Quiet Canine Competition
« Reply #34 on: January 23, 2013, 12:54:20 PM »
Hi Skorch

By a quick look to the code, the only bottle-neck I found is about the Serial.print; it's a heavy function indeed, capable to saturate the memory in few time under the worst conditions.
I suppose it writes the strings into RAM, and then it prints on the screen.
Maybe the string format is not optimized... I don't know.
I can only tell you to try recompiling the code without any serial communications; so comment the print function and see if it works.

I hope it will.

MJLorton

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Re: The Portable Dog Killer / Quiet Canine Competition
« Reply #35 on: January 25, 2013, 09:44:01 AM »
Hi Skorch,

Thanks for the fascinating post....I love descriptive stories like that.  :)
Scary how destructive mice can be!!! I've seen how bad ants can be with electrical and electronic appliances if they start nesting...I keep a sharp eye open of any ant trails these days!

I'll certainly give you a shout for some tourist info as I'm sure I will return to your neck of the woods for a visit in the future.

Cheers,
Martin.

Play, discover, learn and enjoy! (and don't be scared to make mistakes along the way!)

Skorch

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Re: The Portable Dog Killer / Quiet Canine Competition
« Reply #36 on: January 27, 2013, 10:39:30 AM »
Hey Guys,
just a quick update, first off just wanted to thank RiccardoGiuliani, I am useless at code writing in arduino but I found a new more suitable program @ http://winkleink.blogspot.ie/2012/05/arduino-hc-sr04-ultrasonic-distance.html . With this we've had major success, after loading this program I took only one arduino around to each of the affected rooms in my uncle's house. Then assisted his neighbours in doing the same as one of the effects of scaring these mice away is that they have to go somewhere and they have. As a result of playing my program for fifteen minutes in each room, there has been four days of mice free living for both my uncle and as far as I know his neighbours aswell. We are all now hoping that this program might only need to be run once a week in order to be efffective which is going to save endless time and money as far as my uncle is concerned.
The best and by far the funniest news is that these mice appear to have "moved house", across the street into another set of houses and also my "services" are now being requested in several areas of my uncles large neighbourhood and several others are asking to be taught how to do this work with the arduino for themselves.
As a result of all this I am now quite quickly becoming endlessly popular, maybe not for the most desirable reasons but its always nice to feel wanted nonetheless :) .
Ants is another one I've encountered as well Martin and I have begun to wander with such large sensory antennae in comparison with their body what their "magic freqeuncy" might be and how difficult this absolute fluke of myne is going to be to repeat.
Really wanted to thank you Martin for this idea, its given me so much fun with new friends, old friends and family.
Its just a pity now that Im returning to college after holidays, it will be all biology again for a while but rest assured I'll do my best to keep up to date and I'll be back to try your next idea as soon as my course allows.
If I ever really can be of assistance with the tourism side of my country please do ask.
Thanks Guys     
« Last Edit: January 27, 2013, 10:58:16 AM by Skorch »

SeanB

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Re: The Portable Dog Killer / Quiet Canine Competition
« Reply #37 on: January 27, 2013, 11:01:25 AM »
Don't know if ants are affected by ultrasonics but I do know they follow live cables and tend to accumulate inside the boxes until they fill them and short the electrics out.  Very common in pool pumps and gate motors. Gecko's tend to commit hara kiri on the boards as well, and destroy the board by the arcing they start.

MJLorton

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Re: The Portable Dog Killer / Quiet Canine Competition
« Reply #38 on: January 28, 2013, 03:22:15 AM »
Thanks for the post Skorch!
Play, discover, learn and enjoy! (and don't be scared to make mistakes along the way!)

RiccardoGiuliani

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Re: The Portable Dog Killer / Quiet Canine Competition
« Reply #39 on: February 10, 2013, 09:00:37 AM »
Well... it seems I'm posting a job for first.
Nothing transcendental, simply the basic NE555 astable configuration.
The big problem has been looking for an ultrasonic transducer, due to lack of time: luckily a local technician had and gave me a series of old remote controllers with ultrasonic transmitter.
I quickly tested the circuit, like in photos: the multimeter shows 30 KHz, maybe you're able to see the K at the extreme right of its screen. Frequency been measured directly on the transmitter (I suppose it's piezo).

Luckily again; it appears to be not polarized, so next step will be a test with a H-bridge of transistors, to double the output dynamics.

birrbert

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Re: The Portable Dog Killer / Quiet Canine Competition
« Reply #40 on: February 10, 2013, 10:51:17 AM »
Acquired some courage now that somebody made the first presentation :)

High res photos: 1 | 2 | 3.

My Quiet Canine device on a breadboard as seen on the photos. Everything was pretty straightforward except maybe for the piezo tweeter; I eventually went for the KHS 107 because it was the smallest in size amongst the ones I found locally. The rest of the components came from China.

The circuit is working, but with the very first test I got a very very loud and deafening sound. I took it to a friend who has an oscilloscope and he told me that the output is somewhere around the 10 Khz area. So, it's audible by humans and I personally have the feeling that whenever I push the button a thousand braincells of mine die per second. It's really-really loud and bad for the ears. Trust me, I'm not exaggerating! Everybody be cautious! Wear ear protection! Or, the least you can do is put your tweeter facing down and wrap a piece of cloth or towel around it!

My case is a bit special and I almost suffered because of it. Luckily, together with Steve and his friends over at the Google Groups discussion thread we figured out that the KHS 107 is not the ideal tweeter. It has higher capacitance and this is the reason why I'm getting "only" 10 Khz sound. So, I have two options to reduce the capacitance: 1) reduce the value of C2 (originally 4700 pF, but in my case half of that would be ideal) or 2) use a smaller inductor (e.g. 680 uH instead of 1000 uH originally).

I'm about to decide what to do, but I'm having huge problems getting hold of components fast (i.e. locally). We'll see what happens. No enclosure yet so no idea how the final circuit will look like and whether I will solder everything on a PCB or not... :(

PS: On the last photo you will see a 560 pF capacitor. I found it on the PCB of an old satellite receiver so I desoldered it and tried it out. The output frequency got much higher, too high in fact, so I'll need a ~2000 pF capacitor, but at least this proves that playing with C2 does affect the output frequency.

PS2: once again, Everybody be cautious! Wear ear protection! Or, the least you can do is put your tweeter facing down and wrap a piece of cloth or towel around it!
« Last Edit: February 11, 2013, 02:41:14 AM by birrbert »
"Dubito ergo cogito, cogito ergo sum." Descartes

tomaz

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Re: The Portable Dog Killer / Quiet Canine Competition
« Reply #41 on: February 10, 2013, 10:35:20 PM »
Hi all,
nice to have some pictures :)

On Saturday I also started building this ultrasonic device ;)

My first goal is to get sound around 22kHz. I don't remember where I was reading (in December) about this 22kHz, maybe I'm wrong, but I had to start somewhere:)... On wiki I saw it depends of the dog (breed and age), but they can hear up to 40kHz.

Since 555 can delever 200mA on output I was thinking why not driving it directly to piezo/tweeter?
It works, but, few problems and solutions:

 - R1 was very hot after minute or so. I changed R1 with 1W resistor, but it will still go to 70C (pic3). Damm Ohm's law :):), thanks Martin for explaining it.

 - I wanted duty cycles to be around 50%. I was thinking to make higher values of resistors so they wouldn't heat so much, but if I do, duty cycle increase also. I found possible solution here, to user diode:
   555 and calculation:
   http://www.horrorseek.com/home/halloween/wolfstone/TechBase/com555_555TimerCalc.html
   My to-do:) but I hope 555 will still give me 200mA, I will see :)

  - when I connect piezo tweeter to output, square wave is not so square anymore, but it works :)

 - I tried battery and variable power supply. On variable power supply, if I change voltage on input also frequency change. I don't like this. Any ideas how to make frequency more voltage independent? I was thinking of 7805 or something like this? Reference voltage? But then I will also get lower output :(
   questions:
    - I was thinking to get sinusoid wave out of square wave. Would this produce better 22kHz sound?
      Square To Sine-Link, or RC filter (3 pole): here
    - the process above would decrease signal, would it be good idea to then use op-amp and increase volume of output?
    - or if using square wave to use op-amp to increase volume of output even more?


Of course, you don't have to answer any of questions/problems, I'm just thinking while writing. Thanks for reading :)


Since I didn't use earplugs I'm heaving buzzz in my ears :( :(  I hope it will stop soon:)

P.S.: Arduino/Rpi PWM would be too simple and we wouldn't learn anything about 555 timer :)

Tomaz.

SeanB

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Re: The Portable Dog Killer / Quiet Canine Competition
« Reply #42 on: February 10, 2013, 11:28:42 PM »
Decouple pin 5 with 10uF or so to ground, along with a 470-1000 uF capacitor directly across pins 1 and 8 will help with the stability. When I did mine years ago ( must dig it out and photograph it)  I added a heatsink on the 555 to keep it cooler. Was helped by using the TO99 can version though.

dr_p

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Re: The Portable Dog Killer / Quiet Canine Competition
« Reply #43 on: February 11, 2013, 02:54:37 AM »
Any ideas how to make frequency more voltage independent? I was thinking of 7805 or something like this? Reference voltage? But then I will also get lower output :(
7805, 78L05 or a zener diode+R. This powers the 555, but you add a transistor on the output, thus all the logic is regulated 5V, but the piezzo gets the full voltage


    - I was thinking to get sinusoid wave out of square wave. Would this produce better 22kHz sound?
Yes


      Square To Sine-Link, or RC filter (3 pole): here
    - the process above would decrease signal, would it be good idea to then use op-amp and increase volume of output?
    - or if using square wave to use op-amp to increase volume of output even more?
If you use the output transistor, all your problems go away ;)

And since you're at it, find a switch mode transformer (usually yellow ones) and drive it with the transistor. The high voltage output goes to the piezzo. I've driven them up to 250Vpp and it's a LOT louder than at 4-5Vpp


tomaz

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Re: The Portable Dog Killer / Quiet Canine Competition
« Reply #44 on: February 12, 2013, 02:47:13 AM »
Thank you for very good ideas (SeanB and dr_p)
I will try them. Yesterday I have disassemble old computer power supply and found yellow transformers.
There were 3 transformers, 2 of them yellow (bigger and smaller). I will try smaller :)
For transistor, I will try BUZ31, which I bought for DC load...
Tomorrow, I will report results.

Thanks again!
Tomaz.